Current (Summer `09) E-SSC Power Systems

Any SSC class topic can be discussed here.

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Lee Liddle
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Current (Summer `09) E-SSC Power Systems

Post by Lee Liddle »

I`ve recieved quite a few requests for specs and links to what I`m using right now in SSC.

I`ve switched to outrunner motors this year and after about 30 heats and some test flying, I`m satified that this system works well. These light weight outrunners are not quite as durable as the inrunners that I have used in the past, but when you factor in the light weight and much cheaper price, I think it`s a good way to go.

Here`s what I am using for a motor.
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/stor ... 0Kv_/_345w


You need an ESC that is good for 6s. Here`s a good one with a BEC
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/stor ... shless_ESC


and here`s one without a BEC (seperate rx battery or bec needed)
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/stor ... ontroller_

here`s what I`m using for batteries. these also make a great battery for 3696

http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/stor ... h_3S1P_20C
Lee Liddle
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Post by Lee Liddle »

If you want to save about 2oz, you can go with a 5s motor/battery. Bob Leone is using this on his plane, which is a 60" Falcon wing with a light weight, simple fuselage/tail assy.

5s motor
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/stor ... 0Kv_/_470w

and use one of these 2s batteries in series with one of the 3s batts listed above to make your 5s
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/stor ... _2S1P_20C]

Use the same ESC with the 5s system
Lee Liddle
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Post by Lee Liddle »

The information listed above should be enough of most e-savvy pilots to get an E-SSC in the air.

For those who are just starting to use electrics, and need more details, feel free to ask any questions here, and I`ll try to get you the info that you need.

I`ll also get an airplane from Bob so that I can post details of his fuselage assy. Lee
sgilkey
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Post by sgilkey »

Lee, i'm pretty ignorant on this stuff but Mike Fuller had an e-Falcon for SSC at nats and it was fully competitive, actually extremely impressive! VERY agile and excellent speed. I can't recall what he used for motor but i think it was an outrunner. He said it was pretty under-taxed and was capable of more performance, and I think he said he was drawing only maybe 17 amps??? very impressive setup and nice plane/design!!! plenty durable too, he used two for nats and they survived well enought that he loaned one to Chris Gunter for his last heats! nice job on the design!
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cshepherd
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Post by cshepherd »

Lee, thanks for the info! I've purchased things from HobbyCity before, so I'm comfortable dealing with them.

What are you using for servos?

Speaking of 3696, what is your motor choice for that?
sgilkey
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Post by sgilkey »

Brian's had pretty good luck with the Hobby City stuff. He had a few ESCs and batts go bad last year, but this year just about everything he's gotten has been a great value and performed well.
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Blue Note
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Post by Blue Note »

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by sgilkey</i>
<br />Lee, i'm pretty ignorant on this stuff but Mike Fuller had an e-Falcon for SSC at nats and it was fully competitive, actually extremely impressive! VERY agile and excellent speed. I can't recall what he used for motor but i think it was an outrunner. He said it was pretty under-taxed and was capable of more performance, and I think he said he was drawing only maybe 17 amps??? very impressive setup and nice plane/design!!! plenty durable too, he used two for nats and they survived well enought that he loaned one to Chris Gunter for his last heats! nice job on the design!
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

That was very nice of Mike to allow me to fly his electric in my final heat. I was plagued by engine and battery problems on the 2nd day and got to talking to Mike about the electrics and how easy his setup seemed. I can't remember the specifics, but the ability to tune it in exactly on 17,490 at full stick was impressive. Electric definitely has some attractive qualities, but I'm still concerned with the weight, cost, and survivability ( especially the Li-Pos ) when contact is made. DEFINITELY something I plan on looking into more closely. The ability to make a very clean airframe with an electric is right up my alley.
EK
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Post by EK »

I'm a slimer but fly against 7 or 8 electrics, 4 - 5 consistently each month, and don't see any of the weight / survivability issues come into play. With Lee's or Bob's setup, cost doesn't appear to be the issue either. Most of the electrics here in N.Texas are of different design so we're not talking just one setup. It goes back to basics, if you continue to tear up airframes beyond what you deem acceptable, the solution is to build stronger and give up some weight (and performance) until an acceptable amount of loss is achieved. But, you can't count center punches in the damage assessment unless you're willing to fly a lead sled.
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Blue Note
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Post by Blue Note »

I realize the need for a ground up design to really take advantage of the propulsion system. Battery vulnerability is what concerns me most, but admitting that I've stayed away from electrics for the past few years, I know technology has vastly improved vastly. I'll have to look into things a little more closely instead of making possibly incorrect assumptions. Lee, thank you for being so active in bringing the electric side of things into the foreground.
Lee Liddle
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Post by Lee Liddle »

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Lee, I'm pretty ignorant on this stuff but Mike Fuller had an e-Falcon for SSC at nats and it was fully competitive, actually extremely impressive! VERY agile and excellent speed. I can't recall what he used for motor but i think it was an outrunner. He said it was pretty under-taxed and was capable of more performance, and I think he said he was drawing only maybe 17 amps??? very impressive setup and nice plane/design!!! plenty durable too, he used two for nats and they survived well enough that he loaned one to Chris Gunter for his last heats! nice job on the design<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Hey Scott, thanks for the E-report from the NATS. I saw that C/F was there, but had no idea that he was flying an E-Falcon. Ed and Scott have done a great job of kitting the E-Falcon. They even modified the airfoil a little and I like their airfoil better than what I was using. It tracks better and has better outside performance. I`m even buying cores from them, instead of cutting my own.
Lee Liddle
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Post by Lee Liddle »

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Lee, thanks for the info! I've purchased things from HobbyCity before, so I'm comfortable dealing with them.

What are you using for servos?

Speaking of 3696, what is your motor choice for that?

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Hey Chris, no problem, I`m glad to do it. For servos, I`ve been using nothing but the GWS Mini Standard for about 5 or 6 years. They cost about $10, weigh 27g, have a pretty durable nylon gear train, and replacement gear sets cost about $1. They use the same servo arm as JR, but I use stock arms on most everything. I do use 6v to help with speed and torque. Some people don`t like them, but they work for me.

For 3696 I`m still using up some old Tower Pro 2908 motors, but some guys have been using this motor and are happy with it.
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/stor ... :_AXi_2814

This one works well too, if you want a motor that is a little lighter and cheaper.
http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/stor ... _AXi_2808)
Lee Liddle
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Post by Lee Liddle »

Chris G. I certianly understand your concern about the lipos. They are the most fradgile part of the power system for sure. At first I was exactly the same, but in 3 years of using nothing but electric power in SSC, and maybe 200 official heats, I`ve never damaged a lipo flying SSC. I did loose a single cell once, when I didn`t tape it in well (I was using a 4s and a 1s in series to make a 5s battery). They got knocked out of the wing and fell about 100ft. I found the 4s (it was fine), but lost the 1s.

Putting them in the wing has worked out well, because since they lay long side running with the span of the wing, when a sudden stop does happen, they don`t crush.
Lee Liddle
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Post by Lee Liddle »

As far as different airframe designs go. I think that everyone is now using the Falcon wing core from Ed and Scott. Bob and JP are using it with their own fuselage design, JP`s is all wood with an aluminum motor mount. He`s using a 5s A-123 battery and a Turnigy SK 3536-1400 motor. I`m not sure what esc he`s using.

Bob`s is a hybrid design of basswood, G-10 and aluminum rails for the tail-boom. Bob is using the 1400kv motor listed above (Turnigy SK 3530-1400) on a 5s 2200mah lipo (one 2s and one 3s) and he uses an inexpensive liner bec to power the rx. He powers the bec off of the balancing tap of the 3s battery. Very slick, light and cheap.

Rick and Ben B (need to check spelling on the last name) have switched from their own flying wing design to the E-Falcon. They are using 5s A-123 for the battery and a custom wound Scorpion motor. I`m sure Rick can chime in and give motor details next time he logs on.

Daryl Ellison is using some of my old Falcons that he has re-built like new. He`s using up last years Ammo inrunner motors and is getting ready to switch to the 6s Turnigy SK 3530-1100. He`s helping Guy Willis get started in SSC. Guy has used some of Daryl`s old Falcons and equipment, but is ready to go with the out-runner stuff that we are using now. Not sure if he`ll go with the Falcon, or use a fuselage like Bob is running.

Scott Stockwell is flying the E-Falcon (of course) and will be going outrunner/lipo. he has been using Ammo/lipo.

Fianaly, Dane McGee has told me that he is getting his son set up with E-Falcons. His son likes to fly, but doesn`t like the IC power. Dane flies IC powered Falcons and Cobras.

So that`s 8 pilots who have flown contests with E-power in N Texas this year and at least one more on the way. There was also a guy from the Sherman club at the meet on Sunday that was very interested in the E-SSC planes. He seemed like a serious prospect to me.

So that`s a run-down. As you can see it is an interesting mix of equipment (like Evan said). Way more than one way to skin this cat.
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Blue Note
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Post by Blue Note »

I looked at how Mike Fuller had his set up. I noticed he was running 2 rather large packs. He said it was so he could fly two rounds SSC or one round Open B. What kind of recharge time are you looking at with the batteries you have experience with? I guess that requires cooling time also after flying. How many cycles on the packs until you can "feel" the decline in performance? I fly my own designs, so I could work around most placement issues if I feel it worth the effort, I just realize most of my gear is outdated due to the battery and motor advancements and would need replacing, so I'm trying to get a good grasp about what I'd be getting myself into going electric. Do you feel you run at a disadvantage to the IC engines as far as unloading in the air is concerned? Sorry for all the questions. I'll poke a round and look at a few more electric videos.
NeilD
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Post by NeilD »

A different look at the durability....

I fly a speed wing 400 with a turnigy inrunner motor, 40amp ESC, and 2200 mAh battery. All purchased at Hobbycity. I have had several hard crashes, one from a high speed stall in a big dive. I mount my battery right on the nose of the wing and have not lost a battery do to damage.
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