Event timing, what works...what does not..


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THend
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Event timing, what works...what does not..

Post by THend »

Greetings All,

I've long wanted to fashion a event clock for combat. A clock large enough to be seen by everyone, well, at least at the events I am involved with. Might be possible to sync-up multiple clocks for large venues...

So, what is the timing cycle being used? Of course the two fixed times are the call to "Start and Launch" 90 second window and the "Start Combat" 5 minute window.

How much time is needed for retrieval and flight preps? Too often out here we seem to have difficulty keeping things movig along. I think a clock rig could keep everyone on pace.

I was thinking, starting at the 12 o'clock position and breaking up the times into a pie chart style: Start and Launch 90 seconds, Start Combat 5 minutes, End Combat 2.5 minutes, Pre-Flight 4 minute window followed by a Pre-Flight 1 minute window. Then the cycle starts again.

That is a 14 minute cycle that should be fairly easy on the pilots. Downside is, it seems long to me and only 4 heats per hour! Yikes!

Granted, maybe the pace can change based upon the size of the event. I find it easier to compete at a large event with many heats as there is so much available time. In a larger event this schedule most likely would not work.

So, what do you folks think?
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cshepherd
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Post by cshepherd »

I think Terry Harner for Prez! [:p]

On a more serious note, your timing sounds about right. Not sure about the two pre flight windows at the end.

My take assuming one's sh** is together and they aren't trying to build an airplane on the flightline....

90 second start and launch
5 minute combat
5 minute retrieval and ready for next round

11 minutes and 30 seconds max. Could be cut shorter if all planes are able to land on runway and quick turnaround, or could be held as needed.
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Ed Kettler
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Post by Ed Kettler »

The "Pam Fraley" CD seems to work well for our events where we have multiple heats, like LSN. Between rounds, you may need some time to get "back to backs" ready.

You need to set expectations at the pilot meeting about the tempo you want to run so that everybody knows the pace you want. Things that will get in the way:
- Long searches
- Distant crashes
- Back to backs
- Repairs
- Unprepared pilots
- Slow speed OGCs

At a big event, pilots need to understand that they may miss a round if they have to do repairs or aren't ready. In cases where I've had a guy needing time, sometimes I can arrange a heat swap with another pilot.

The "clock" is a good idea, just needs to be visible and correct at all times. For our local contests, it is mostly "Pam" and I running things.
THend
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Post by THend »

Well, one thing I am a stickler on is consistancy, especially when it comes to communicating what is what during a contest. I've seen and heard so many ways to run our events, and some work better than others.

The reason for the split on the Pre-flight is because the rules section on round structure dictate that the CD or Line Marshall announce at least 1 minute until "start engines and launch". I would prefer to use wording like " 1 minute of pre-flight prep remaining", which would reduce the possibility of someone thinking that the actual start and launch signal was given.

I've been to maybe two contests where a recorded message was used, and it was OK. Actually the one event was torture because they played, what I thought was very bad music in between the recorded voice. Plus, you have someone, maybe even yourself running an engine and you can't hear a dang thing.

I've wanted to do this for a long time. I really appreciate any input, and am curious as to the timing on the recorded CD.

Can someone provide the timing on the CD?
Vapor52
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Post by Vapor52 »

Terry, send me a personal Email at <vapor52@yahoo.com>, My sprint Email is down at the moment, and I will send you the file.At the Nats we gave an extra 5 minutes between rounds when there were back to backs the first 2 days, the last 2 days I followed that rule but personally communicated with each pilot and shortened the 5 minutes extra when they were ready. Worked extremely well.-------rick
Oehrle
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Post by Oehrle »

Greetings

For my contests, I have been very fortunate to have the same Field Marshall. Our field is now under a time limit to stop flying by 1:00 so we all have to hussel to get eight rounds in. This last contest rather than split rounds we flew all eight at once and were done in under three hours. Yes, we could have used the extra hour and having fewer pilots helped--I'd just as soon have fifteen or twenty to deal with. In the future I may have to go to six rounds.

Most liked the back to back quick turn around and back in the air. That does require for people to show up on time, have planes preflighted and generally ones act together. The slow down is one when someones wants to due repair or swap engines. Yes, tough for a new guy with only 2 or 3 planes. My self if a plane is in doubt, I go to another plane.

Recovery does take times no doubt and between round pilots like to talk about their latest kill etc. The field marshall really comes in to play here--keep it moving. Before the 90 second clock starts, he checks to make sure everyone is ready-plane ready, got a judge, streamer attached, head attached etc. This step has proven to be a big help and when rushed can and has lead to some problems.

Gary Oehrle
THend
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Post by THend »

Thank you everyone. If I can get this worked out, I think it will be very cool and keep the game moving along.

I know it isn't always easy, and being beat on the ground can happen, but it is important for all pilots to get combat ready and then BS.

TH
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dirko
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Post by dirko »

I was slow and unprepared. I think Rick kept things at NATS moving along rather well. Good job Rick!
sgilkey
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Post by sgilkey »

I'm gonna wax nostalgic here a bit. I understand the need to keep things moving because we have events scheduled, multiple classes, a certain number of rounds (and usually everybody wants as many as possible, I mean we're there to FLY, right?) But BACK IN THE DAY, at least my memory tells me, we had 1) usually one class (when I started we only flew 704/2610)or at most two 2) more pilots and 3) fewer total rounds- i seem to recall five per day was "typical". Yes, there was also more damage as the building tech was still early. But IF you didn't have to madly repair a broken plane, you had time to walk the line, admire other planes, swap engines, BS, etc. Now the pace, number of classes and rounds and fewer pilots means to survive and be ready for every heat, you have to bring more RTF planes- no time for engine swaps, field repairs (other than minor). etc. It's still fun of course but is more like "competition" and less like "hanging out with the competition." That's the way it's evolved but I'm not sure overall it's been for the best!
Hat Trick
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Post by Hat Trick »

I think the line marshal is the biggest thing in keeping the contest moving in a more than 3 heat contest. Try to get recovery done quickly. The golf carts at Nats really help here. When the pilots are ready get them airborne! No reason to spend 5 or 10 minutes between heats if it's not needed. This means asking if anyone is not ready and making sure all the pilots who are supposed to fly are ready. This means the marshal has to be someone who knows the majority of the pilots names or has some way to identify the pilots. It's tough to figure out if the pilots are ready if you don't know who they are! Heats 2 and 3 should be no problem as no one is back to back. Heat one there usually are back to backs. If someone needs a lot of time try and get someone to switch heats to give them more time. All the pilots know they are going to have a back to back so having a second plane ready to go in case of a wreck is a good idea and saves contest time. You will have at least 2 down heats after your heat one flight so you'll have time then to repair.

Contests with 2 heats are harder because you are almost always flying or judging so there is almost no repair time.
Web-Pilot
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Post by Web-Pilot »

At our contest yesterday, we used the timing done by Mitch Eaves a few years ago. I transferred it from the CD to a MP3 player. I think it works great! We have an amplifier that is pretty close to the pilots so hearing is usually not an issue unless it is right at Start Engines. Once launches are done, it is very easy to hear. Judges have to pay close attention so they can let the pilots know where they are on the timing window.

Yesterday we flew all up, so used 10 minutes between rounds. That gives enough time to get the planes back and get ready for the next round. I just let it run. That is almost 4 rounds an hour. We ran 6 rounds of SSC and 6 rounds of Open B with a 30 minute lunch break from 9:30 to 1:30. If you want to work a little more, you can start the 5 minute timer after everyone is back from the field. I prefer to let it just run on 10 minutes. We only had to stop the clock a couple of times for a couple of minutes to allow pilots time to get ready for the next round.

If we are flying heats, I like to run the timer with 5 minutes between heats and 10 minutes between rounds. 5 minutes between heats is just enough time for pilots to get their planes out of the field and the next heat is almost ready to take off. You can't dilly dally around in the field and slow everything down. 10 minutes between rounds usually means get the last plane recovered from the field and start the 5 minute timer again. With Back to Backs, you sometimes have to allow more time for pilots to get ready, but usually it keeps things moving well.

Just my $0.01 worth.

George
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