GMS NEWS FLASH

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StarRider
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GMS NEWS FLASH

Post by StarRider »

HEY ALL,

AS MOST OF YOU MIGHT HAVE ALREADY SEEN THAT TOWER HOBBIES WILL STARTING TO SELL GMS ENGINES IN LATE JULY, I WILL CONTINUE TO SELL THEM UNTIL I AM OUT AT MY PRESENT PRICES. AT THIS TIME THE 25s ARE ALL GONE. IT WAS FUN WHILE IT LASTED! BOOHOO.....

Star-Rider

Check out the LOWEST PRICES on GMS engines!!!
http://www.gmsengines.com
RCAMERICA
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Post by RCAMERICA »

Lee, we just can't continue to thank you enough for all the great prices, and quality service you have provided. THANKS!

Chuck

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StarRider
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Post by StarRider »

Thanks for the kind words, RC!

I have a question if you guys can help me out, I had my own theory but like to see other opionions!

What can be the culprit that will allow an engine to run for a few minutes and then die in the air even when adjustments are at full rich?

Star-Rider

Check out the LOWEST PRICES on GMS engines!!!
http://www.gmsengines.com
Cajun
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Post by Cajun »

We have six GMS .47 engines in the 2 local clubs and only one of them is in use. The rest are on the shelf for the exact problem Lee states. Some were bought from Lee, some diredt from MECOA. I'm glad to see him admit he hasn't a clue as to what's wrong with them.
They run entirely too hot and go lean in the air and die no matter how rich the carb is set. Fuel tanks and lines and carb seal are not a factor. I worked on one for two days on the bench test stand and at full throttle it would go lean and get boiling hot with me opening the throttle and spent fuel spraying out of the muffler. Every time this engine ran at full throttle it would die so hot it smoked. No air was observed in the fuel line and the carb base was sealed.

I tried various blends of fuel/nitro/oil without making any difference. My personal opinion was this engine was overcompressed and added two head shims and eventually another plug gasket. No difference. We removed one glow plug from this engine and the idle bar was burned completely in two. I have never seen this happen before.

All of our engine gurus have worked on this for a year without success and I'll put our engine men up against the best. Returning the engines to Mecoa and Lee is futile. Mecoa has no warranty and Lee has no warranty and no service. All we get is excuses and smart mouth replies. Returning the above engine resulted in a note from Lee that there was nothing wrong with the engine and after removing the extra head gaskets and changing from a R/C plug to a non-idle bar plug the engine ran fine on the bench. He added a smartmouth reply about the engine guru that had worked on it along with a bill for $10 for inspecting it and $8 for shipping it back. The owner of the engine, I think, has told him to keep it and put it where the sun don't shine[:(!] and purchased an OS.

I don't know all there is to know about servicing and repairing 2 stroke engines, but I have been working on them longer than Lee has been alive, and the combined engine service experience of the guys that have worked on these engines is well in excess of 100 years. It is an insult to their intelligence to state that removing the head shims and changing to a non-idle bar plug would cure this problem. In 40 years of servicing engines, this is the only the second one I have had to return to the company for repair. And what do I get? No service and a smart mouth reply.[B)] If Lee had found the problem, he would not have started this thread[:0]

This is not an indictment of ALL GMS engines. I personally own two, a .25 and .47. The .25 is a good engine that has never given problems. The .47 when new and prior to running needed carb service including smoothing the throttle barrell, sealing the carb seat, and sealing the backplate. It also runs too hot, and has always done so, but does run OK and has good power. Personally I would never purchase another as there are too many other decent engines from reputable distributors and retailers on the market. Bought from Tower, one might get some service.[?]

If you will read the Mecoa warranty, you will find it covers nothing. In fact just disasambling the engine to get the carb to work automatically voids whatever semblance of a warranty they may have. But what can one expect from a firm that publishes a note saying their carbs are not meant to kill the engine[:(!] Are they not admitting they are selling junk. Our engine gurus (Lees' term, not mine) are advising the other club members against purchasing engines from Mecoa as we will not go to the trouble of looking at them or touching them, and Mecoa will not service or warranty them. I am our club instructor and will no longer instruct students using engines from MECOA. I have better ways to spend my time

I full well realize there are many owners of GMS engines who are fully satisfied with them. I'm happy for you. I'm glad you received what you paid for. But, I am not happy for the ones who have had the problems stated here and in Lee's thread opening post. It appears U R Stuck. <font color="red">Don't bother posting here what great service you have had from these engines, as that does nothing to help the ones who have had the bad experience. </font id="red">






CAJUN [8D]
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StarRider
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Post by StarRider »

Cajun,

I did not initiate the use of "engine guru", it was in reply per quoute by your friend! As you see Cajun, I still did not mention any name(s)! I just want you to know I am going to refund his purchased price instead of sending him a replacement as I had mentioned to him earlier!

The history of this started since he bought this in June 2, 2002; This should had been addressed asa when the situation arrived instead of sending the engine in dated May 27, 2003 close to a year after purchase!

I was at Mecoa and witnessed the actual testing and found the engine was not running smoothly in its send in condition, but it ran fine after the 3 engine shims that was in the engine were replaced by a single new one and the idle barred plug with a non idle plug. We ran two 8 ounce tank of fuel through her and tempted it with my infra red themometer periodically while running and was in between 220/230. This was done on an engine stand out by the dock with no air conditioning in 70* temperature. I know the engine will run cooler when its in the air unloaded.

Cajun, have you thought about what you wrote about GMS being junks? If that was the case, do you think Tower Hobbies would actually snatch this from Mecoa? Have you though in the not so distant future all engines will cost you more out of you precious pocket when they control virtually all engines available in the US? I personally am taking credit that they saw me as a threat to their engine sales of represented lines of Super Tiger, Tower Engines, OS and so forth.

As for your attack about my intergrety, it was totally beligerant from my view. I had never posted any provacative nor angry comments on this board, but I am making an exception to your reply! I don't want to further this anymore! Maybe the Texas atmosphere is not suitable for GMS engines I don't know, but whatever the case there will not be a GMS sold by me in the state of Texas from today onward! I do not want to cause anymore greive there! This is not a lost to me!!!



Check out the LOWEST PRICES on GMS engines!!!
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Cajun
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Post by Cajun »

Since Lee has seen fit to do the right thing with his customer, I'll not continue this further. It would serve no purpose.

Just remember one retail concept. If you purchase an item from a retailer, whether it be a Main street store, a mail order company, or a E-retailer, you are entitled to received value for what you spent. If you do not receive expected value for your money, then it is time to demand it, and the fact that the retailer is a friend on the Spad site or elsewhere is totally immaterial.

One should not have to resort to public exhortations on a web forum to nudge a retailer into doing the right thing with a customer.

I stand behind everything I stated in my original post, and now this case is CLOSED.

CAJUN [8D]
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Cajun
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Post by Cajun »

And now that we have that out of the way:

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">What can be the culprit that will allow an engine to run for a few minutes and then die in the air even when adjustments are at full rich?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

Anyone have any ideas or theories. We have several other engines, that exhibit this same problem. The owners are reluctant to return them to the distributor for whatever reasons.

My opinion is these engines are running entirely too hot. They run hot on the ground and get hotter in the air even when needled excessively rich. If my theory is correct, why are they running too hot? The head bolts are properly torqued, the ports in the sleeve/case are aligned, the muffler is not restricted, no air leaks are evident, the bearings are OK, and the engine turns free.

Could it possibly be the anodized heads? I'm not a metalurgist so I don't know about this.

If heat is not the culprit, then what?



CAJUN [8D]
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Spinner
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Post by Spinner »

I'm the person that this GMS problem is related to. I want to thank Lee for his timely responses to my emails and working through this conflict to a solution at his expenses. Let it be know the Lee issued a complete refund out of his pocket. When it should have been Mecoa in my opinion that should have covered the faulty engine by warranty. .

StarRider it was you who first used the words "engine guru" I quote "I know you won't like to hear this, but in regret you engine guru didn't served you well..." in the next email to you I mention Cajun's name "On closing I would like to say that I was disappointed in you StarRider when you referred to Cajun as not serving me well..." We both know how you were referring to when you used the words.

I want to thank Cajun who has spent many house working on trying to get my GMS 47. He even loan me he personal engine so I could continue to fly while Mecoa check out mine. Many thanks to all the other that try to help resolve my engines problem.

I would like to know what difference does it make when an engine is send in under warranty even if it is sent in the last day it ought to be honored The men in the two clubs to which I belong kept working with the engine hoping to find a solution none was ever found. With a month remaining I decided to send it in to Mecoa for repair under warranty. If I had sent it in the first month or three months later would the results be any different? I THINK NOT!

In another email I sent StarRider I replied,
"I was disappointed when I received you email. If all Mecoa did was run the engine on the ground then yes I will agree the engine does run. In fact I have ran more the two tanks through it on the ground but the engine would over heat and the rpm would sag. What other test did Mecoa perform on the engine" Did they check the head temperature while it was running etc. I didn't buy this engine to run just on the ground or in a race car. The engine in question as I mention to the individual that I talked with at Mecoa, is know as the 5 minute flyer out at the field. No mater how you set the needle values even sloppy rich it would quite running aft about 5 minutes while in the air. The individual said that I must have run a tune pipe on it. No way I ran it right out of the box.

I'm a member of two clubs the Nacogdoches Model Airplane Club and the Propgrinders of Lufkin, TX. The men in this clubs have many years of experience flying model planes. And they could not get that GMS 47 to run correctly in the air. What does that tell you are they all wrong? Did they all not serve me very well? We tried different pugs different number of head shims, run tanks of fuel through it on the ground. In the end both clubs gave up on it. If you looked at the engine you would have notice that the ionized gold colored head now looks like polished chrome. In fact I had one individual ask the make of engine and I informed him it was a GMS 47 he said that can't be they have a gold colored heads. That in and of it's self speak volumes it shows it was running hot and something major was wrong. Did Mecoa or even you look at the head of the engine? The longest flight I ever got out of the engine was 10 minutes. No there were no air leaks in the fuel line etc. I put another engine on the plane and it ran and flew fine. Please note that I will no longer have my GMS 47 that my wife bought for me as a birthday gift. (I'm not going to pay even $1:00 two get that engine back let alone $18:00. I'm not going to send good money after bad. Yep I'm nipping it in the bud and Mecoa can keep it.)

Does it tell you anything that there is no one left flying GMS engines in either of the two clubs. One individual owns two and they set collecting dust. There are others that own just one and are no longer using them. I know not one, who will ever buy another GMS including me..."

I hope this clears up some of the flack that has be going around. There were other emails sent back a forward between me and StarRider and I see no need to post or refer to any others. As far as I'm concern the problem has been resolved and is closed.

Spinner
frankc29
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Post by frankc29 »

It's too bad this issue could not have been resolved in email land.

<font color=blue>Save trees..fly </font id=blue><font color=red>S.P.A.D.</font id=red>
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Frank Costa
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spaddawg
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Post by spaddawg »

Hey Lee,

Do you still have that engine Spinner sent back to you? I might want to buy it off of you. E-mail me buddy!!!
Later..

James Image Schell
Las Vegas, NEVADA" Member Of TEAM SPAD DAWG'S"
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Cajun
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Post by Cajun »

Frankc29, I agree totally. We tried and failed.

The forums are no place for this nonsense, but[?][?][?]



CAJUN [8D]
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D-mon
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Post by D-mon »

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by StarRider</i>
What can be the culprit that will allow an engine to run for a few minutes and then die in the air even when adjustments are at full rich?

Star-Rider<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

I have 3 thoughts:
1) The engine is sucking air in somewhere (Needle? Carb seat?) resulting in a lean run.

2) Tolorances too tight between the piston and sleeve.

3) Not enough lubricant in the fuel.

#1 is anyone's guess as to where air might be coming in. SEAL EVERYTHING with red RTV and put a chunk of fuel line on the needle.

#2 is a long-shot, but might be solved by hand-lapping the engine with plenty of castor oil on the moving parts.

#3, these engines might be intolerant of <20% oil content (like the old Fox engines). Maybe dump enough castor oil in the fuel to bring the content up to around 30% or even 35%.

If none of these work, scrap the thing and score an OS.

JMHO,
D

Darin Bellis
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